RealGiganitris posted this other thread and linked to a dance song. I was going to reply and rant in that thread, but I thought It'd be less of a jerk move to not ruin his thread and instead start a new thread.

His post was here:

http://www.cplusplus.com/forum/lounge/138956/


Before I start, I'll say that everyone is certainly entitled to their own opinion and they can like whatever music they want. That's all fine. I'm not trying to criticize RealGiganitris for his tastes. I hope he (nor anyone else) is not personally offended by any of this.


But Dance music fucking sucks. I really hate it.

Also I lied: I do hope to offend someone. I hope to offend whatever talentless asshole made that fucking song.

--------------

I very recently had a Facebook conversation with a buddy of mine in which I (very politely) explained why dance music sucks. He linked me to a retro style chiptune song thinking I would be into it (since I'm generally into NES-era video game music). Here's our conversation below:

He wrote:
Hey [Disch]. I'm curious to hear what you think of this track. I think they did a pretty good job of mimicking the classic video game sound: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HxZn6CzOIo

I wrote:
It's alright. It suffers from "dance-itis" -- too long, too repetitive, and no hook. The best modern "retro" video game music I've heard is probably the Cave Story soundtrack... but even that is like 10 years old now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zW7Dmx9WYQ&index=31&list=PL0A12ED38862DB0F5

He wrote:
Dance-itis. Haha. I like that term. Since electronic music went mainstream dance-itis infected it all. I read an interview with Nintendo's composer a while back. He was talking about the challenge of composing a short song, with very few sounds, that is OK to listen to for hours at a time. Pretty interesting.

I wrote:

Lyrical music has the advantage of having unique lyrics that keep the listener entertained. Even if the melody is repeated over and over again, it's not so bad because the lyrics are different which keeps it fresh. Instrumental music doesn't have that luxury. It has to find a different way to be fresh. In NES-era games this was typically accomplished by simply not having the melody repeat... ever (or at least very infrequently). Here's a classic example from Duck Tales. Listen to the main melody. Notice how it never really repeats: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQtRnc1D7YY The SMB main theme does have some repetition, but not a lot. It only repeats the same melody twice before switching to an entirely different melody: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGX4obVl64w The Wily theme from Megaman2 alternates between 2 main melodies, but does minor variations each time to keep them interesting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dp_O42DX_08 Dance music doesn't do this. It just repeats the same thing over and over and over. With little if any variation. Booooooring. Even when there are lyrics, it's usually just 5 words repeated over and over and over. To compare, the AdhesiveWombat song you linked establishes the main melody in the first 15 seconds of the song. Then just adds background layers without mixing up the main tune at all. Somehow it stretches that 15 seconds of tune into a 4:30 song. Waaaaaaaay too long.

For the record... I timed RealGiganitris' song's melody -- it's exactly 7 seconds long. That 7 seconds is just repeated for just about 3 minutes. The song literally does nothing else... I listened to it. It doesn't make any changes... there's no bridge... there's no breakdown... there's not even any harmony. 7 fucking second melody.

The only thing the song does to mix it up is change which instrument is playing the melody (I counted 3 different instruments that it cycles through). Oh and I guess at one point it actually had two different instruments playing the same melody on top of each other! That part was inspired (sarcasm intended - this song fucking sucks my balls)


I fucking hate dance music.


The melody isn't even very imaginative. And in fact... the melody itself is repetitive. It's exactly 17 notes: A 4 note pattern that is repeated 4 times (with slight variations) and one extra note in there.


Did I mention I fucking hate dance music?


Though I suppose there's good and bad in any genre. Hell, there's even some rap that I like (though not very much). For whatever reason bad dance music in particular strikes a hateful chord in me. I don't know why. Maybe because it's so boring, talentless, and unimaginative -- yet people gobble it up like it's the greatest thing since sliced bread.


So yeah. Fuck dance music. Or more specifically... bad dance music.

Why is it called "dance music" anyway?
As for me, I prefer un-danceable music that also sounds good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNfpb2_wvd8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRcBqLh_FNg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EO6wx-jqhUI

I like these Disch posts. They make my day. I share the same feelings with you.

Some fun stuff to listen to there Catfish. Will keep https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRcBqLh_FNg on in the background for a while.

Personally I think old video game music might of actually made me less effected by this type of music. Anyone want to try and argue against certain old video games having some of the worst repeating music known to man?

Although I hate "almost" all rap 1000% more than this stuff (ughhh the lyrics....) the 'dance' music you linked/quoted definitely isn't great.

DISCLAIMER: I didn't read the thread, I just saw the words 'dance music' and felt like sharing some good electronica.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogMNV33AhCY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fdr-Fiv92c

Your just listening to the wrong kind of music for the kind of dancing you like is all:

Dance to this in the bath https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6gmbcDTLqU.

This is good, nice n dreamy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CpVfYnuD15w

@Cheraphy:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogMNV33AhCY

This one is certainly better than the kind of music I was talking about. Although I don't like that vocalist style (like new rocky male voice -- he sounds like the singer in every other rock band since 2007)

Also he makes a very audible noise when he inhales which is distracting. Other than that I sort of skimmed over the song and it seemed decent enough. Not quite my thing but I don't hate it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fdr-Fiv92c

I didn't listen to much of this one... but...

HAAAATE. See all above points of why this music sucks balls. Nevermind that it takes A WHOLE FUCKING MINUTE for the song to even start. 30 seconds of which is basically silence.


If you want GOOD Electronica/Dance...

JAMIROQUAI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEAOzOTm6bU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNo9TCfk0Jw

GOLDFRAPP
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPHm5IcfvnE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYCfHzlWmSU

SCISSOR SISTERS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrTQ_qik6yo <- quality on this vid kind of sucks
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLZCwRUiYYs


@devonrevenge:

Your just listening to the wrong kind of music for the kind of dancing you like is all:

That is Trip-Hop (basically downtempo electronica), which is an entirely different thing.

But... if you want GOOD Trip-Hop

AIR
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YkgfmWfJ11s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CvzSDuMaltI

BLUE STONE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WnzUQ2p1ESs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFdkRASLbIg

ZERO 7
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFeiKq9OvRA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idtRhja2rAM

MONO
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4o0reNjF04
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCVWZqMwNss


EDIT: Changed link to Blue Stone - Dreamcatcher... since the previous linked video has breaks in the audio.

This is a good song. Even though normally I don't like hip-hop. I like the singer.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnS7RswoZyc

WHY DID YOU BRING HIP HOP INTO A THREAD ABOUT ELECTRONICA!!!???!?!?

Oh, you like Trip-hop? A classic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=li-adM-qOwI

And knowing your tastes probably not your style, but some Witch-house/dreampop:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-s8hmcglRQ

Disch wrote:
WHY DID YOU BRING HIP HOP INTO A THREAD ABOUT ELECTRONICA!!!???!?!?

*BHX mask on*
You should let the topic evolve naturally, like it would in a casual discussion with friends.
*BHX mask off*

@Cheraphy:

I have mixed feelings about Massive Attack. They remind me a lot of Zero 7... only not nearly as good.

A lot of trip hop suffers from the same problem that upbeat/dance electronica does: too repetitive (see: RJD2). Though I'm not sure if I'd say Massive Attack has that problem -- I haven't heard enough of their stuff to judge.

This is the first time I've heard Purity Ring.... eehhhhhh.


If you want classic old-school Trip-Hop... this song pretty much defines it. I still love it after like 20 years:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gD3SLxibaH0

I don't think there is a problem with dance music the genre; the problem is there is a lot of BAD dance music that is popular (and therefore most often played and heard). There is a plenty of good dance music out there, that is far more than a copy + paste exercise.
Some dance music evolves and changes constantly, especially in melody, mood and timbre. I think the genre is far more diverse than people realize and that there are dance music producers out there who are pretty much incomparable to the commercial rubbish you will generally hear being played. For example

Shogun UFO - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxKJvXE_frY
-Several really good melodies, a fairly fast evolving track with many different timbres, hardly any repeats and an absolutely beautiful breakdown.

Andy Blueman ft. Driftmoon - Exodus
-Dance music with a strong classical music influence. The violin melody is absolutely wonderful!

Hallucinogen - Shamanix - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SmByuni4d-E
-This track changes up melodies and timbres so fast you have to listen to it about 20 times before you hear everything that is going on.

Anyway, my point is, dance music is a very diverse genre and not all dance music is like the commercial rubbish you might hear day to day.

Don't worry Disch, I personally didn't like the song posted either for its inappropriateness as well. I didn't like EDM for a long period of time until I heard Deadmau5 play house music. That was the first EDM I have ever liked. My friend got me into Euphoric Hardstyle (which doesn't make me gay) and while exploring the internet, I came across that song. I hated the lyrics but loved the vocals and the instrumentals. It's very unique for EDM in general to have such vocals and melody mixed with a distorted beat. I dislike that song myself but I believe that such a combination has the potential to sound amazing. That's why I asked for related music. I like chiptune by the way but I like it going slow (exeption for the Super Squat Simulator theme).

Also, repetitiveness isn't always a bad thing in music (though it mostly is).

(This is one of the most famous songs of all time)
Example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPmruHc4S9Q